TOPIC: New HA filler claiming to last up to 5 years

Unlike Dr Morganstern and Dr Oates you and Moorgate aren't doctor led practices, your business model doesn't suit anything other than HA, as Biggy mentioned. You just aren't specialised enough to offer something like Ellanse, I'm sorry to say.

Unlike Dr Morganstern and Dr Oates practices, you and Moorgate aren't doctor led practices

Dr H owns Androfill, it is doctor lead. www.androfill.com/about-us/

your business model doesn't suit anything other than HA

The Androfill business model is to minimise the risk of complications (Androfill is Dr Horn\'s clinic, the risk and responsibility stays with Androfill/Dr Horn).The brokerage model of Moorgate etc is incentivised to offer higher risk products like Ellanse. When the sale is made the risk is legally transferred away from Moorgate.
The broker/sales does the selling, but the risk and responsibility is transferred onto whichever doctor is performing the procedure on the day.

You just aren't specialised enough to offer something like Ellanse.

Getting a good result with Ellanse is not the difficult part (assuming you can get a good result with HA). It is dealing with complications.
Once the degree of complications is understood, Dr Horn will have the same ability as Dr Oates and other suitably qualified surgeons to deal with them.We are waiting to see how bad/stubborn the complications are, before giving the green light to Ellanse.

Androfill wrote: Below are the Before & After photos of a clinic using Ellanse. This will be the shape of the patient\'s penis for 4 years if Ellanse E was used.
If the patient had used HA and this result had happened, it could just be dissolved away, and re-done properly.

Seems to me all this needs is more Ellanse to the front shaft. Plus, the gain on 11mls is dramatic.
Also, a result like this would never be allowed to walk out of Dr. C or Dr. Oates offices. This is either applicant error or terrible patient post-op care.

Androfill wrote: Below are the Before & After photos of a clinic using Ellanse. This will be the shape of the patient\'s penis for 4 years if Ellanse E was used.
If the patient had used HA and this result had happened, it could just be dissolved away, and re-done properly.



In regard to the topic of this thread, patients can try Cutegel Ultra HA which Dr Kim claims to last 5 years. However, it is unrealistic that it will last this long.

Not a great result with the Foreskin retracted - as Aleksk has made us very aware of. I assume the patient is happy.
I think it could be improved with further Ellanse tapering towards the glans and base. And if he was cut probably no problem at all. I think the result will probably last a lot longer than 4 yrs too.

Any thoughts on Ravensse Versa HA?

It has pooled together into a ball and is unevenly distributed in the centre.
This can make it more difficult to engage in intercourse and can cause the partner some discomfort due to the lack of taper.

More towards the glans might help (Foreskin permitting) to even out the result, but also more filler is needed behind the ball of Ellanse, towards the base to support the forward filler.
The below could be the result of poor filler placement or poor aftercare; insufficient moulding/spreading of the filler in the days following the procedure.

A result like this would never be allowed to walk out of Dr. C or Dr. Oates offices.

Agreed.

But once the patient leaves the clinic, a significant amount of the final result (as we are dealing with a malleable substance), is in the hands of the patient.
That means with Ellanse / PMMA your patient selection has to be tighter, and your aftercare and instructions better (as you can\'t fix the result).






The filler can move on its own for a number of days and intervention can be required at home, often when the patient is not thinking completely clearly particularly if the result is looking misshapen.Doctors need to be more selective with Ellanse / PMMA patients and I am not sure how they can be pre-selected (pre-departure) when they are flying in from abroad.

I see Moorgate (the clinic providing the result above) have now restricted their Ellanse selection criteria to \"over 45-year-old patients\" after heavily promoting it earlier on to all patients. It is encouraging to see Moorgate putting in place some additional criteria for Ellanse patients, however, I am not sure that \"over-45\" is the right parameter for selecting patients for Ellanse.- It is also being promoted to over 45s, for improving a wrinkly penis which I thought was amusing (if it were a widespread concern amongst over 45s, HA or any other filler would deal with this by adding volume).

randomword1234 wrote: Any thoughts on Ravensse Versa HA?

Ravenesse Versa is a HA made in Canada. It uses proprietary \"Wet milling\" to produce perfectly round particles of HA. Although Allergan will tell us its product is monophasic and not particles.... they all push the limitation of their version as it unique benefit.
We don\'t have it in Australia and I have not seen any publications to back up the claims it \"integrates better with less swelling\". Interestingly they don\'t seem to have a range of thinner/ thicker products. Shall we ask them to send me 100 ml to do some trials?

Dr Oates wrote:
I am waiting on more info from the Sydney doctor on these and will get back. I think Ellanse can be great but less forgiving and unfortunately it will be a bit of trial and error. I do plan to write an article about complications of injection Phalloplasty.

Any chance the \"nodes\" were small areas of scar tissue?

Penis rejuvenation? Wrinkled penis? What a joke. This industry clearly doesn\'t have any limitations in taking advantage of the gullible. What they fail to understand is that they come across as charlatans.

It is disappointing and a nonsense claim from Moorgate.

I think, in small part, it is because penis enlargement is the subject and men are the consumers, that somehow people feel it is ok to be misselling. The standards should be higher.

This Foreskin is only half way retracted, which is very clearly visible (you can make out the outline of the glans). If it was fully retracted, the distortion would be much more worse.

Agree.

Penetration is nearly impossible in such circumstances. I speak from experience.

Agreed, that is what I mean above. With that shape, it would be nearly impossible to penetrate and not great for the woman/partner either. I still think this is a poor result.

Your advice of injecting more towards the base doesn\'t work. That\'s what my doctor tried. As I explained, I ended up with three distinct Michelin-like tires sitting on top of each other and Asymmetrically bunching up left and right. Even worse than having a ball-like distortion bunching up forward in the middle.

Agree in regards to HA. You would have had distinct/discrete lumps of HA gel as you describe and it would not be helpful.

However... I was referring to the case in the photos, which is Ellanse, and this is different.

The patient in these photos could, as pointed about above by Dr O and another member, improve this result with more Ellanse, in a way that an improvement could not be achieved by adding more HA.

Initially, if more Ellanse is placed either side of this ball of Ellanse, it might still feel like three discrete globs, however, after some time (3-4 months) the sections will integrate better together than HA will with pre-existing HA.

I hope I am communicating this clearly.

Dr Oates wrote:
Ravenesse Versa is a HA made in Canada. It uses proprietary \"Wet milling\" to produce perfectly round particles of HA. Although Allergan will tell us its product is monophasic and not particles.... they all push the limitation of their version as it unique benefit.
We don\'t have it in Australia and I have not seen any publications to back up the claims it \"integrates better with less swelling\". Interestingly they don\'t seem to have a range of thinner/ thicker products. Shall we ask them to send me 100 ml to do some trials?

How long does the manufacturer claim Versa lasts? Any idea how it would hypothetically compare to Voluma?